johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 The attached drawing is what I propose as the basics for group transiting between columns, rows and blocks. The other three possibilities are just the reverse of these. From this I know can rework easily most of my existing work. From this group transitings, I will create the 16 grid version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwmeek Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 In most all of these maneuvers it strikes me that where the different kites get isolated, and start and stop moving at different times, gives a less graceful appearance. Some thought should be taken to ensuring that at least two kites begin moving and stop moving at the same time. It might require that the kites move at different speeds, or it might require a completely different approach to getting the kites from one position to the next. Just one opinion on the animations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 In most all of these maneuvers it strikes me that where the different kites get isolated, and start and stop moving at different times, gives a less graceful appearance. Some thought should be taken to ensuring that at least two kites begin moving and stop moving at the same time. It might require that the kites move at different speeds, or it might require a completely different approach to getting the kites from one position to the next. Just one opinion on the animations. Many thanks for your inputs. At this time we are only working on the rough basics. Once we have the basics worked out we will be going into a much smoother timing of which we will need a lots of input from teams as to what would be more appealing to the public watching. At the same time we will be creating elements that smoothly fit together with each other. Don't expect this project to be ready next month, however we are shooting for the spring in the northern hemisphere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 The attached drawing is what I propose as the basics for group transiting between columns, rows and blocks. The other three possibilities are just the reverse of these. From this I know can rework easily most of my existing work. From this group transitings, I will create the 16 grid version. We have not had reason to use transitions like these previously. I was referring to calling the rows (1-4) to form diamonds in a vertical stack:- / \ \ / / \ \ / / \ \ / / \ \ / or columns (1-4) to form diamonds in a horizontal stack:- / \ / \ / \ / \ \ / \ / \ / \ / The blocks are as previously suggested:- AA BB AA BB CC DD CC DD There are no moves to go to, just the identification of the group. That being said, you have started to formalise the 'American Football' moves that I had in mind which could be very interesting indeed. Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 We have not had reason to use transitions like these previously. I was referring to calling the rows (1-4) to form diamonds in a vertical stack:- / \ \ / / \ \ / / \ \ / / \ \ / or columns (1-4) to form diamonds in a horizontal stack:- / \ / \ / \ / \ \ / \ / \ / \ / The blocks are as previously suggested:- AA BB AA BB CC DD CC DD There are no moves to go to, just the identification of the group. That being said, you have started to formalise the 'American Football' moves that I had in mind which could be very interesting indeed. Felix Really, I don't have a clue on the 'American Football' moves. I lived in Europe the majority of my life. I am more knowledgeable about football(known as soccer in the USA). I think it should be called World Football instead of Soccer. Do you have a preference of how AAAA are laid out in the box format or is what I posted yesterday(early today your time) adequate? I will work on you diamond basics late today(early tomorrow your time). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 Really, I don't have a clue on the 'American Football' moves. I lived in Europe the majority of my life. I am more knowledgeable about football(known as soccer in the USA). I think it should be called World Football instead of Soccer. Do you have a preference of how AAAA are laid out in the box format or is what I posted yesterday(early today your time) adequate? I will work on you diamond basics late today(early tomorrow your time). The Rows to Block 'is' the 'American Football' thing! I am not clear about AAAA. I had only used that letter based notation to define the four blocks in the 16 grid. <grins> Maybe we are talking at cross purposes here. The basic diamonds would be good to see. I'm wondering if it will fit in with the more radical transformation you have already animated. Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 The Rows to Block 'is' the 'American Football' thing! I am not clear about AAAA. I had only used that letter based notation to define the four blocks in the 16 grid. <grins> Maybe we are talking at cross purposes here. The basic diamonds would be good to see. I'm wondering if it will fit in with the more radical transformation you have already animated. Felix Using the scheme in the drawing yesterday, I would suggest that: AA - AA AA - AA would be: 01 - 03 02 - 04 I believe that the more radical diamond transformations will not be a problem. Last night I had already started sketching it out ideas, when my eyes could no longer look at the PC monitor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 Using the scheme in the drawing yesterday, I would suggest that: AA - AA AA - AA would be: 01 - 03 02 - 04 I believe that the more radical diamond transformations will not be a problem. Last night I had already started sketching it out ideas, when my eyes could no longer look at the PC monitor. We need a simple 'name' for the four blocks. The level of abstraction is obviously needed at a drawing level but on the flying field the fliers need to get the call without delay <grins> I have attached very rough sketches of a couple of transitions I think could be quite useful... Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 <snip> I believe that the more radical diamond transformations will not be a problem. Last night I had already started sketching it out ideas, when my eyes could no longer look at the PC monitor. I think that the Zig Zag may be a distraction. Here are some more rough sketches. Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 I think that the Zig Zag may be a distraction. Here are some more rough sketches. Felix Oops, there was another image I wanted to post. Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 We need a simple 'name' for the four blocks. The level of abstraction is obviously needed at a drawing level but on the flying field the fliers need to get the call without delay <grins> I have attached very rough sketches of a couple of transitions I think could be quite useful... Felix This seems very close to "7 - Ball" which is already on line. I will look at it closer when I get home this afternoon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 This seems very close to "7 - Ball" which is already on line. I will look at it closer when I get home this afternoon. The final frames from 16 grid to ball are the same. The preamble is, I think a long way from the way the 16 grid has been established in practice which may be the source of a problem. Lets look at the start sequence of the grid again... Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 In most all of these maneuvers it strikes me that where the different kites get isolated, and start and stop moving at different times, gives a less graceful appearance. Some thought should be taken to ensuring that at least two kites begin moving and stop moving at the same time. It might require that the kites move at different speeds, or it might require a completely different approach to getting the kites from one position to the next. Just one opinion on the animations. As John said, thanks for your input. I think that the objective has to be for quick transitions to be from one recognised 'figure' to the next recognised 'figure'. I favour the idea of 'morphing' so that the transition itself is effectively a 'figure' of controlled relative movement. The key to this is that the fliers know where they are starting from and where they have to get to. I think that we may have to recognise the 16 grid as the starting point at this stage for the development and description of moves. Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 We need a simple 'name' for the four blocks. The level of abstraction is obviously needed at a drawing level but on the flying field the fliers need to get the call without delay <grins> I have attached very rough sketches of a couple of transitions I think could be quite useful... Felix "Four Blocks" No problem, I can do this for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 I think that the Zig Zag may be a distraction. Here are some more rough sketches. Felix No problem, I can do this for you. How would the two horizontal lines be formed, say from one horizontal line. Groups 2 and 3 drop down while groups 1 and 4 move together over them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 Oops, there was another image I wanted to post. Felix No problem, I can do this for you. I'll be back on this all in several hours. I have some other tasks that I must do now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwmeek Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 (edited) Here's another way to go from 2 lines to 4 diamonds. It gives each kite a more-similar distance to move. I particularly like that it goes from 2 lines -> apparent chaos -> 4 diamonds (appearing suddenly from the chaos) Edited November 30, 2010 by --Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 The final frames from 16 grid to ball are the same. The preamble is, I think a long way from the way the 16 grid has been established in practice which may be the source of a problem. Lets look at the start sequence of the grid again... Felix We could work this out with three different approaches to the ball. One from column groups, one from box groups and one from row groups. What I had already done would be from box groups. Renaming is very trivial, so if you wish to use different naming, please let me know. However once names are established, we should not change them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwmeek Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 However once names are established, we should not change them. Amen! This makes getting the names right extremely important. Get comments from people who speak other languages as well, so translations (or inadvertent similar sounding words) don't confuse things. Remember the trouble that English-speaking cosmologists had when it was discovered that "Black Hole" meant something else entirely in Russian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 Here's another way to go from 2 lines to 4 diamonds. It gives each kite a more-similar distance to move. I particularly like that it goes from 2 lines -> apparent chaos -> 4 diamonds (appearing suddenly from the chaos) I think that we have line wrapping issues there but I would be happy to be proved wrong in the sense of organisation resolving from apparent chaos... Thanks Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 We could work this out with three different approaches to the ball. One from column groups, one from box groups and one from row groups. What I had already done would be from box groups. Renaming is very trivial, so if you wish to use different naming, please let me know. However once names are established, we should not change them. Naming is not, in any practical sense, my call. We need to get a consensus from the participants. The ball from 16 grid just needs to be documented as we have identified it at this stage. Once it has been called on the field 10 times it will be written in stone... <grins> Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 <snip> How would the two horizontal lines be formed, say from one horizontal line. Groups 2 and 3 drop down while groups 1 and 4 move together over them? I have to ask why it would be interesting to go from one horizontal line to two horizontal lines when there are so many other transitions available, apart, that is, from the "American Football" moves. <grins> Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 What I am thinking is back when you launch and how you would get to the dual horizontal lines. Would you be launching from a grid formation on the ground or as a lined up, or both? Then form one of the basics. Or would it be a random launch, get use to things and then form one of the basics and work from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnmitchell Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Felix, The columns to Ball(7.3) and Ball to 2 Horizontal lines(7.2) are now on-line. The Big Square to Ball(7.4) will be available in about 24 hours along with some of the others. John M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted December 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 What I am thinking is back when you launch and how you would get to the dual horizontal lines. Would you be launching from a grid formation on the ground or as a lined up, or both? Then form one of the basics. Or would it be a random launch, get use to things and then form one of the basics and work from there. Arc up to grid is a possibility with 16. I described a parallel alternate facing ladder-up as well. What should be avoided, in my view, is the random launch although it may have a place in the practical experience <grins> Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.