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I Need Some Advise From You


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Thanks for asking Ben ...

1) If Barry's signature is on the kite, then he gets a veto vote on what ever you do. When folks have asked me if a Pro is really worth the money, my response is "When a craftsman signs his work, it's worth it." Please don't dilute that expression of pride.

2) Others might notice the problems, without knowing the back story, and assume the flaking will happen with all Rev kites. Thus, the kites need to be clearly marked as "different" than normal.

3) I like the idea of "donating" them to individuals you see in your travels ... kids who show an interest in kiting and help you out at festivals. Clubs and stores that focus on bring new fliers into the family should also be considered.

4) Sell them? Sorry Ben, but that doesn't feel right ... especially a Pro. I know they're functionally correct, but it just doesn't feel like something a company who prides themselves on quality does.



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I'd buy a black center Pro with the logo that eventually flakes off, . . . who cares after that first flight, on their first Revolution. It's not a flaw, it's marked as my own! See all that abrasion?, well I put that there with my flailing style over concrete seawalls and asphalt parking lots. You too can learn to fly outrageously (like me) and currently at a reduced price.

Rev could offer those printer's error sails as a "trade-in/demo" on the skin only. Who wouldn't like a brand new crispy sail on their pros?

Naturally our local kite club (WoW) could use a complimentary demo model for lessons as well. (lightest weight frame, full sail please,... we'd never use a vented sail locally!)

Run an auction on pairs of flawed kites and makes some new fliers out of all those Rev widows around the world.

A visual flaw almost doesn't count, I wouldn't think these sails should be destroyed. If the flight dynamics were compromised though, that is a whole different matter!

The paint, ink, coating, whatever,.... flakes off on the masterpiece kites too, some of those sold at $900. The dragons were sold with this effect in place before they were folded up and shipped the first time!

Sell 'em all Ben, if you can. I just bought two new Pros (shipped last week) or I'd be leaving a message on the office machine instead of typing this right now!

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I would weigh in with antman on this topic.

I have a very early rev that I love, but not crazy about the color (faded hot pink and blue).

On a very limited income, and would dearly love to own a Pro.

Anyone who happened to notice any sort of minor printing flaws would get a complete explanation and the handles for a bit. :blue-grin:

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Were they custom pros? If they are then I say destroy them. Part of the joy of having a custom pro is knowing that the odds of a duplicate out there are more remote thereby giving the buyer a one-of-a-kind experience. To find a sub-standard duplicate out there somewhere cheapens that experience for the person who did pay a premium for a custom.

Otherwise, demo them.

Don't sell them.


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I also believe if they are custom-order 'Pros they should be destroyed. Bart's explanation above says it all.

EDIT - I also believe Bazzer should have the say on what to do with them. I also think they would make good contest prizes.

But, if not custom, I believe they should be sold. I don't understand the logic; they are unfit to sell because of a cosmetic flaw, but we can show them to new pilots and folks who haven't seen a Rev before??? So we're going to show them cosmetically flawed Revs for their first experience??

Kite store owners already buy their inventory at a discount, even if its not much of a discount.... And they already have kites in stock to use as demos...... So Rev should only give them the opportunity to buy these 'Pros, to use as TRAINER kites??? No way. How often do the consumers get the chance at a discounted 'Pro? How often does a customer get the chance to buy a 'Pro, and not have to wait a couple months for it to be made?

If these were any other Rev, I might agree with giving them away as trainers. But these kites were handmade. By the best kite maker in the world. With the best materials. For an amazing company. I just don't see it as being fiscally responsible to not sell these.

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Okay enough I've made up my mind,,,,,,,, 10 stack for Ben......blue_cool.gifblue_cool.gifblue_cool.gif

It's easy to be dispassionate when you haven't got the cash to spend on one (or more) of these kites. So here goes:

  • Revolution have funded the materials and labour costs for producing the kites (and any remaking cost);
  • The kites are not really 'beginner' grade kites;
  • Most fliers would have little concern about the print quality - at a distance (say 120 feet or more) it's not the most important thing;
  • If Revolution are worried that print quality would tarnish the brand image, then they might wish to prevent product entering the market;
  • If Ben has a healthy marketing budget, then company representatives (i.e. Ben and Joe) could retain them as (advanced) demonstrators for use at kite festivals - targeting Rev pilots (EXP, SLE and 'B' series) who might just be considering their next kite choice.

Whatever happens, please be kind to the kites and let them take to the air - I'm sure they don't want to sit on a dry shelf or wall and fade under artificial lights.

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If sold at discount as "seconds", they will certainly eventually be held up as "poor quality workmanship of Revolution" sometime in the future when the background is forgotten. Even if stamped "seconds", I do not think they should be introduced to the general buying public. It will come back to sting the company ... IMHO.

If sold to stores as "Demos", and so stamped, the stores will certainly (at least all the stores I have ever dealt with) explain to new fliers why the kites are "demos", and why the printing is sub-standard. That will only build the buyers' confidence in Revolution standing behind their quality standards - even when it was a supplier that goofed. (And I might get an opportunity to fly a Pro :w00t: )

As for whether B Pros are suitable for beginners ... I haven't yet had the chance to fly one. But I think the idea that EXP's are better suited to beginners has more to do with the investment needed to learn quad flying skills than the flying qualities of the kites. I'll defer to the shop owners and other more experienced fliers on this point. But, I still have not reached the point where I can really distinguish between an SLE and a B in flying qualities. Most of that, I am sure, is because I have a B full sail, SLE mid-vent, and B full vent. Thus I cannot really compare comparable kites. The SLE mid-vent flies better for me in that in-between wind range than either B kite. (If anyone is offering me a B mid-vent, I will not be so ungracious as to turn down the offer. :P)

Having returned to sample my original EXP since flying the better kites - yes, the EXP does not perform as well as the B or SLE (or at least I have to adjust to the different responses). But it performs well enough for a beginner to learn without the larger expense of the better kites.

One of my personal experiences: there once was a PC manufacturer who advertised that the "Quality goes in before the name goes on". They actually made decent PCs (and once upon a time, very good radios). I ordered some AT class machines for the company I worked for. When we opened the boxes, the logos fell off the front of the CPU. :huh:

Appearances are very important!

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Well that opened a discussion up. And I can see the point of all the posts.

I say, Ben do what feels right, we all trust and love you, whatever you decide will be the right thing to do.

However it is almost Christmas, and I am sure a big red outfit (with shorts of course) would look good on you.

Just think of the BIG smiles on the lucky faces, if given or sold, and the continueing smiles each time they are flown.

I lean towards give them away, however as I said above, whatever you decide will be right.

Have a good Christmas my friend.

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I say give them all to me I'll have the Gonzalez brothers print me some center panels that say Referbolution at my expense then I will pay someone to sew them on and back cut the old ones off and start a team in Newport called The Referb's :kid_smartass:

But seriously, why not have someone in the factory just sew on some new center panels right over the old ones, right inside the seams then back cut the old ones off and sell them discounted to people you know will never come back later on and pull the quality card crap.

Problem solved, No worries of it ever coming back to bite you knowing the people who will get them fully understand what they are getting and are reputable.

I'm still partial to my first choice however.

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