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First Real Day Out


avellinijr
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Hi. Today was my first real day out with my EXP, meaning there was consistent wind. It was really fun but I think it might have been too windy. When the gusts picked up the kite would pull really hard and I had a hard time finessing and hoovering it. Trying to get a feel flying inverted the wings would flip over and I would lose temporary control, it also made crazy spins at times. Is this due to high winds? Not tooting my own horn, but I think I did better than I thought I would. No where near good, but just able to keep it in the air and turn and stuff like that. It did feel as if it was lacking control. Thinking if I was better, I still felt the inability to pull off the manuevers I see on the YouTube videos. Any input? Also if I were to upgrade (I can see this becoming a REALLY expensive hobbie/addiciton) to the B 1.5 which would better suit me with fluctuating wind conditions from 5-20 with gusts, STD, Mid Vent, Full Vent? Any feedback greatly appreciated. Thanks.

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Hello, and welcome to the Dark Side!!

Sounds like you had a good flight for your first time out!

In regards to flipping the wing during inverted flight, that's usually due to OVER-control, so next time you're out flying try and have a lighter touch.

I believe the crazy spins you were experiencing were due to over-control as well, especially if you were experiencing this in stronger winds.

You will develop a lighter touch with time - there is no easy way to learn this art, just practice and repition to build muscle memories. Take a break from practicing every once in awhile to make sure you are enjoying yourself!

Concerning an upgrade to your EXP, I have to recommend all the kites you mentioned: standard, mid-vent, and full-vent would necessary for the range you specified (5-20 mph) :( there isn't one Rev that will handle it all (maybe a B2?).

I really don't know what to recommend here. The full-sail B, IMO, flies well between 3-10 mph. The full-vent flies well in 10-18 mph, again IMO. I've never flown a mid-vent. So, if your conditions are normally calmer, get the full-sail B. If normally windy, get the full-vent. Hopefully someone will recommend conditions for the mid-vent.

When the gusts picked up the kite would pull really hard and I had a hard time finessing and hoovering it

I didn't know you could run an inverted hoover! For questions about hoovering and Revs I should refer you to forum member katrina, she flies the wind-tunnel models :lol:

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mbro - you read my mind on that one!! If I could suggest a cheap upgrade to the EXP - get a standard 1.5 bridle!! Made from a better material, less stretch, more control!! Only $12-15 from most dealers, it can really bring the EXP to life and takes minutes to install!! Remember too, that all the 1.5 frames are interchangeable, so you can increase your flying wind range by swapping frames!! If you want to eventually widen your flying range, consider any of the full vented sails! With a full sail (your EXP) and a full vent (any model), you'll cover almost any wind encountered!!

I agree that no single sail is perfect in all winds, but 2 will get you by!! After that, it's just a matter of how much time you're willing to spend learning!!

I've got a midvent, with 2 wrap as low as 4-5mph, with 3 wrap or race frame 15mph! Probably go higher, but I'm uncomfortable when the kite starts to pull!

Sounds like most of your issues are coming from "overcontrol", try a more gentle touch and guide the kite, not fight it!! Stages of flying 1. - The kite flies you! 2. - You fly the kite! 3. - You and the kite fly together!! The learning curve never ends!! PS: Did you try making leaders for the top lines, let's you adjust the kites' angle of attack into the wind!!

Welcome to the "Darkside", let the addiction begin!! kid_devlish.gif

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Yep, the EXP is just a different model of 1.5!! Uses the same frames as any 1.5 does!! The EXP comes with a 3 wrap, sometimes marked, sometimes not, so using other frames, 2 wrap or race, will give you different results in different winds!! Only thing I don't recommend is that you stick a 4 wrap frame in that sail, you'll probably stretch the wing if you need that strong a frame! There's lots of info on leaders in the Modifications topic, I'd post it for you but not sure how!! Anyone?? confused_1.gif

For line adjustments, put all 4 loops on a stake at one end, then put your handles on at the other! Check to see if both handles are even, if not adjust lines till they are!! If you attempt to make leaders, make sure that all the knots on each are exactly the same as the other!!

Don't be afraid to fly the heck out of that EXP, you'll learn a lot, then graduate to the better models after you learn!! Then you'll appreciate the differences and you can use the EXP to teach others!! kid_devlish.gif

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I've worked with someone else that has an EXP, they don't come with adjustable leaders (pigtails) on the handles, but it's an easy change to do! The bridle thing is easy too, and really helps!! You have to go up to a "B" model to get leaders on handles, and even then, most make new ones of their own!! kid_devlish.gif

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Glad to hear you had fun, practice practice practice and watch the Kitelife tutorials a lot. I love my EXP, I've had it for three months and while I would like a B I think that I still have a ways to go before I really need one. Equalizing your lines and making/buying adjustable leaders will make a huge difference in how your kite handles. I read all the threads and watched the tutorials but didn't do any of the changes until I flew with some people and I am glad I did, it helps.

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When the gusts picked up the kite would pull really hard and I had a hard time finessing and hoovering it. Is this due to high winds?

I didn't know you could run an inverted hoover! For questions about hoovering and Revs I should refer you to forum member katrina, she flies the wind-tunnel models :lol:

Ah, Thanks SkyPuppet! I'm always happy to have an excuse to show off my babies. Here is my matching set of kites and hoovers, a birthday present to myself this year:

5995862493_b9a6babb93.jpg

Now I wouldn't beat yourself up too much if you are still having trouble with your hoover. It would help if I knew which model you are flying. Mine are the Self-Propelled Ultras with Wind Tunnel Technology. This is something like the Pro version of the 1.5s. The specs are almost the same, but it's true you will find the base model more difficult to maneuver. If you have the base model, I would strongly suggest lengthening the cord to 120'. You have the hose attached on the back right? Common beginner mistake. But honestly, you may want to work on the basics with your EXP for a while before attempting to fly your hoover again, especially in high winds.

And yes, it can be a very expensive hobby! I've got my eye on a set of Barresi signature quad line refrigerators for Xmas. Quite challenging to fly of course, but Mr. Barresi has promised lessons. Happy flying, and welcome to the forum!

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He won't tell you this, but I know it be true. If you want to fly the JB refrigerators the door has to be open and you have to remove the racks.

Bart

On a, 'maybe similar level' [NOT] a drummer set up his kit (bass, snare, tom toms, cymbals whatever) and was going through his repetoire during the time we were on Blackheath today.

He was very good but it was great to hear the sounds melt into the space with no amplification...

Felix

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Make sure you have the dust cup secured well so it doesn't fall off during an inverted hoover!

If your wind conditions are as variable as they are here in the Midwest of the US, you can get a full- or extra-vent 1.5, and use vent covers when winds are lighter to increase sail area. I haven't heard of any that are made commercially, but I've seen some home-made that use velcro to attach.

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Funny SV, I didn't know the EXP had a different bridle than the 1.5s.

James, I would call Theresa at the kite shoppe. She has 1.5 bridles, and she has the bridle line that's used to make new leaders. You can order these from her online site, but I'll bet she'll adjust the postage for you if that's all your getting, as bridles and line are small and practically weighless, and will just go in an envelope. kiteshoppe 1-866-ROKKAKU

I can tell you how to make new leaders, I will have more time later on. For right now, though, do you have any thick string or cord around your house? Maybe even yarn, if you braided it first for strength. This is just temporary kluge! Just take a loop of string, say 10-15 inches long, and tie it in a loop. Tie a couple knots in it an inch apart. Larkshead the new loops onto the knot that you already have on your top leader line. Does this make sense? This will give you a sense of what it's like to fly with longer leaders. Your kite will stop being so twitchy and crazy. With longer leaders, you will have to give a lot more input to get it off the ground, just be expecting that. But once you're flying, it should feel a lot smoother.

It sounds like you had a fantastic first day out. Remember the learning curve is steep. Do you ski? wakeboard? windsurf? kayak? Or something like that. Think of something you do where you have to have muscle memory. Even riding a bike, if you can remember what that felt like at first. It's hard at first, you're thinking about too many variables, then things start to click. If you were even trying fly inverted, that's great. Of course the wing tip flipped, that's what happens in the beginning and of course the lines wrapped around the tips (aka tip-wrap) and it went into an uncontrolled spin. We've all been there.

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And regarding what to get next: the usual progression would be to get a full vent (2 vents on each side) B series 1.5. This is the same size as your exp and the rods are interchangeable as SV noted. You will then have the entire wind range covered except for 0-2 and gale force. There will be a point in the middle of the range where yeah, it'd be nice to have a mid vent, but you'll be pretty well covered with a standard sail (the exp) and a full vent. The different rods allow one kite to cover a broad wind range. Later on, you can think about replacing the exp with a b series standard. Lastly, you add a mid.

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I've been reaching a local to fly and she has an EXP! Katrina, I don't know if you met her at the beach on the Sunday we flew during the informal clinic!! There is no dimensional difference between bridles that I'm aware of, but the EXP bridle is made of a different material subject to stretch, the standard 1.5 bridle is nicer!!

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